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@Kazak @wgiwf there's a saying that art comes from struggle (or whatever those goobers say), and I used to laugh at it because I thought it meant you had to be one of those performatively tortured starving artist types to make "real" art. like pain itself was somehow an essential part of the work

but I have a new appreciation for the saying now. it's not about suffering, it's about putting in the work to develop skills, to learn the craft and the body of work relevant to what you want to do, and that journey turning you into someone who can make good art

with AI, almost nobody will put in the work anymore. they can jump straight to an outcome, but the outcome will be shit

it's climbing a mountain vs having a helicopter drop you off at the top

Those people are losers anyway. Most artists are basically insufferable, tranny brained faggots — "i'm important because Im an artist and you have to recognize that". Is that really what you want to support?

As I see it your argument is.... its going to discourage people from pursuing a craft for the wrong reasons and that's bad.

Sorry, AI actually makes art more authentic, no only for the reason I stated above, but because it also brings creation closer to the self for those who don't paint or draw. They can basically commission a work and even refine it to their imagining. The classic artist is far more distant from the self.

All this AI hate is just fuckimg dumb. It's a bunch of NPCs regurgitating talking points without really thinking through the existential relationship between the self and it's ability to create. AI enhances that, and doesn't otherwise prohibit classic methods.

Don't be a faggot. I spend hours a day writing and mixing music, not for you or anyone else. I don't need to alienate my works. I like making things and experimenting when doing it. I do it for me. AI isn't stopping me. Rather it helps me. It organizes sample banks. It assists in calculations and creating fx chains, etc.

If someone else wants to use AI to make a song, that's cool. Go for it. Maybe it will sound like shit, maybe it will be novel, maybe an accident will occur and one that gives us new ideas.

First, I want to thank you for recognizing the difference between having AI do everything for me, and using it as a tool, e.g. a calculator or file organizer, figuring out techniques, recommending I search particular banks or look at particular plugins for certain types of initial samples / sounds (I resample a lot) and other issues, including software bugs, to save me time. Other than file organization and searching (I have 20 million samples / loops, a myriad of vst synths and other instruments, and do design from scratch), use is sparse, but it does help at times.

Nonetheless, as to the novice, I think it could depend on the intelligence of that person. AI can be educational, much like having a teacher. "Hey gpt, what are some classic methods to create a house bass"?​ (The novice would spend more time watching a youtube video to get the same answer or worse tracking down a live producer). So if used right, it can facilitate learning. If not, then not. But the same can be said of most tools. We don't say someone is slop if they use a Phillips screw instead of a nail or glue. The flathead users can get fucked though.

I think the question raised by D implicitly is what is the motivation to create. My point is that AI does eliminate a lot of motivation that I find improper, motivation often leads men down bad roads, like a longing for fame or recognition. Those things are fine if given, but seeking them is a separate issue. The real motivation should be just to make shit.

With this in mind, I think AI eliminates markets in art, but also brings creation / art closer to the self. I can't draw at all. My wife paints, draws etc, hours a day. She makes art for her. If I need a picture, I'll use AI. I leave her to her thing. It's her work, not mine.